ALIEN 3

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ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Wed 24 Oct 2018 - 21:44

Greetings.

I have been a few days testing different modes to sound for the OST of the alien 3, and i think i messed up with one set that definitely sounded very well, but i had to accidentally delete the presets, and the new ones are not the same... however, the restoration from the original file is clear, and a good starting point.

I put here some links, and please, be harshly critical, cause i really want to improve it.


Last edited by Señor Ventura on Sat 10 Nov 2018 - 18:20; edited 1 time in total

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Relikk on Thu 25 Oct 2018 - 4:02

I'm not sure what you're trying to do, but they don't sound that good, in my opinion. The mid range is overpowering everything. It sounds like it's being played through a tube.

If you're trying to "remaster" the original SPC files, as with any mastering jobs, start adjusting ranges or frequencies so that you notice them, but only barely. The result should be an enhancement, not a completely different sound altogether.

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Thu 25 Oct 2018 - 6:38

Relikk wrote:I'm not sure what you're trying to do, but they don't sound that good, in my opinion. The mid range is overpowering everything. It sounds like it's being played through a tube.

If you're trying to "remaster" the original SPC files, as with any mastering jobs, start adjusting ranges or frequencies so that you notice them, but only barely. The result should be an enhancement, not a completely different sound altogether.

I was trying to simulate that kind of sound: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrVbawRPO7I

It is named "wall of sound", which is a technique that is forced to feedback with the reverb of a lot of instruments instead of these directly.

We listened it from "insterestellar", and the result is so impressive.


My intention is that it sounds like a old movie, oversaturated, and spaciated like in a cinema, if you understand, so my edits sounds like that intentionally.

I hope that simply equalizying the low and high bands it fixes the sensation of sounding like through a tube.

Thank you for your opinion.


Last edited by Señor Ventura on Thu 25 Oct 2018 - 19:49; edited 1 time in total

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Thu 25 Oct 2018 - 8:22

Is there a patch for this game, or somebody willing to do it, or are you exercising? Star fox kicked me out completely, so there is currently no hope I'll code it.
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Thu 25 Oct 2018 - 19:42

Conn wrote:Is there a patch for this game, or somebody willing to do it, or are you exercising? Star fox kicked me out completely, so there is currently no hope I'll code it.

I would like to do all the whole patching process by myself, is a pending task. I have in mind more things, and i want to do first an ost for the batman begins and final fight 2, and then coming back to alien 3 to, then yes, begin the stuff for the patching.

What do you think about the sound quality of the song? (the point is to try sounding near this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_of_Sound ).

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Sat 3 Nov 2018 - 6:57

Ah, well. I coded it for you, wasn't much effort.

To map themes make a breakpoint at $2004, write, e.g.,
First Level:
$1F/F00F 8D 04 20    STA $2004  [$00:2004]   A:0002
So it is pcm-02

The code seems to work so far, but you'd need to fill out the loop table at the end of the asm correctly (01 for non-loop, e.g., $0C=pcm-12 stage intro and such.

Much luck

Code file moved to first post


Last edited by Conn on Sun 4 Nov 2018 - 7:35; edited 1 time in total
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Sat 3 Nov 2018 - 22:37

Conn wrote:Ah, well. I coded it for you, wasn't much effort.

To map themes make a breakpoint at $2004, write, e.g.,
First Level:
$1F/F00F 8D 04 20    STA $2004  [$00:2004]   A:0002
So it is pcm-02

The code seems to work so far, but you'd need to fill out the loop table at the end of the asm correctly (01 for non-loop, e.g., $0C=pcm-12 stage intro and such.

Much luck

Right now i'm paying all the attention to the music itself, listening a lot to get inspiration... is a whole world this thing, and it's taking up all my time for now :O

At present i've almost done all the ninja gaiden 1 remastering, and i have some themes for the batman returns already finished...

With alien 3 and my intent of recreating "the wall of sound", sadly i will have to desist (i can't even reach near the results of the remastering video from youtube that i put around here, days before).

I'm progressing, and there is much to learn, about everything (specially when i have to coding), but i'm enjoying a lot, and someday i will do all of this stuff more diligently.


P.D: Thank you so much for your support Smile

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Sun 4 Nov 2018 - 5:09

I see. Ah well, maybe somebody else wants to create the pcm for this game then Wink
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Sun 4 Nov 2018 - 6:31

Conn wrote:I see. Ah well, maybe somebody else wants to create the pcm for this game then Wink

I can do it, but without interesting tricks xD (i really wanted to give it the texture sound of a 80's film).

This next week i will have more free time, and i hope to have better news with my tasks ^^

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Sat 10 Nov 2018 - 18:12

Alien 3 OST finished.

Thanks to this, the issue of the original game playing randomly the half of the channels, is fixed.

Also, all the tracks has been remastered to obtain a good sensation of stereo, clean uncompressed sound, and punching the low bass with some reverb (but not directly aplying reverb filters, but with some tricks of mono channels and delay options).

I think that the result is at least good, give me some feedback to change things to improve (if possible).

Link:
mediafire.com file/8ua6dmio6epd36x/Alien_3_OST.rar/file

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Sat 10 Nov 2018 - 19:41

I saw that you removed my patch link from the forst post, but people will only be able to evaluate your pcm:s with the patch (unless they convert them to wav). It's also better to test in the game to see whether the volume matches.
Also, the loop table needs to be adjusted in the patch, as well your themes needs to be mapped to the correct name.

To map themes make a breakpoint at $2004, write, e.g.,
First Level:
$1F/F00F 8D 04 20    STA $2004  [$00:2004]   A:0002
So it is pcm-02

Can you do this? Other than that great to see progress here Very Happy

Here's the patch again
Attachments
alien3_msu1.zip You don't have permission to download attachments.(15 Kb) Downloaded 3 times
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Sat 10 Nov 2018 - 20:22

Conn wrote:I saw that you removed my patch link from the forst post

Ooops, sorry, i was hurry and i didn't realize of that ^^

Thank you for recover it Smile


P.D: With "GoldWave" everybody can play .pcm's directly without having to convert to .wav's again.

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Sun 11 Nov 2018 - 19:36

Conn wrote:Can you do this? Other than that great to see progress here Very Happy

I understood, the songs are "auto bucle" now, so the loop table is entirely with the incorrect value cause it doesn't need stablish any loop.


So, this is the correct form, right?

org $1fF200 ; loop table
; 01-Non-loop, 03-Loop
; 00 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 0A 0B 0C 0D 0E 0F
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 00-0f - 00
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 10-1f - 10
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 20-2f - 20
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 30-3f - 30
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 40-4f - 40
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 50-5f - 50
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 60-6f - 60
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 70-7f - 70
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 80-8f - 80
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 90-9f - 90
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes a0-af - A0
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes b0-bf - B0
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes c0-cf - C0
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes d0-df - D0
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes e0-ef - E0
db $01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes f0-ff - F0



Conn wrote:To map themes make a breakpoint at $2004, write, e.g.,
First Level:
$1F/F00F 8D 04 20 STA $2004 [$00:2004] A:0002
So it is pcm-02

I'm reading too many STA opcodes in my book, each one doing different things, and i'm lost here.

The $00:2004 do mention to STA $2004 direct paging the theme 00-0f, right?.

But i don't know now why it renames the theme to pcm-02...

As you can see, i'm a disaster actually ^^

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 6:03

I think you do not understand the sense of specifying looping / not looping in the loop table.
I explain with super Mario: in a level the pcm loops forever (you specified where to loop when creating a pcm). But when you die it plays the dying pcm that does not loop.
So the level music will get a 03 entry and the dying a 01 in the table.


For alien3 I see the stage intro not looping and the game over not looping as well (it silences), while the level music plays forever. The intro themes are also non loop (they end).

So start the patched rom with breakpoint 2004, W hook in bsnes debugger. You need to watch the value in A: tp map the themes (simply press run at the debug console if a breakpoint is hit to resume).



You will see in A: the theme that is played with the breakpoint. Don't care that the game is silent, the spc is disabled with the patch, only msu works

00: intro (part1), non loop
01: intro (part2), non loop
05: menu, silent, give non-loop as well
0c: stage intro, non loop
02: level 1, LOOP
09: game over, non-loop

So the first row in your loop table is:
db $01,$01,$03,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01 ; themes 00-0f - 00

You notice that $02 is a 03, so the level 1 music plays infinite? While the others (00,01,05,09,0c) have a 01 (pcm does not loop). If a track isn't present in the game you can have any value in the loop table.
Track 5 is special, you don't need it, it is silent. I made an error check so it does not give a buzz in bsnes, so just don't care about it (no need for a pcm).

Once all the themes are mapped, you need to name them correctly, e.g.
alien3_msu1-2.pcm is the level1 music
alien3_msu1-12.pcm is the stage intro (it was $0C =-12.pcm)
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 6:47

@Conn This information is priceless!!, thank you Smile

Now i have to go to work, but this night i will read this carefully.

Greetings Very Happy

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 7:48

Much luck Spin
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by pepillopev on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 19:13

@Conn, @Señor Ventura Here is the finished track map for Alien 3 [link below]:

Alien 3 Track Map

Señor Ventura, I left a column for you to check off your PCMs as you do them on the track list too [hope this helps you out].

I'm also making a PCM set using the Elliot Goldenthal OST for the movie. I have four tracks to go. I will probably finish them by tomorrow night (or end of the week, depends on my work load, hee hee hee).

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by pepillopev on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 21:39

@Conn This game does not have many tracks. So, here is the loop table (image below) for you to update your patch. Values in question are highlighted (reference track map for additional information).



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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 21:47

Ok, i'm here.



So, the row file results like:

-00--01--02--03-04--05--06--07--08-09--0A--0B--0C-0D--0E--0F
$01,$01,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$01,$03,$01,$03,$01,$01,$01,$01,$01

00: Intro, non loop
01: Title, non loop
02: Rescue Mission, LOOP
03: Station Repairs, LOOP
04: Destroy the Eggs, LOOP
05: menu, silent, non loop
06: Corridors of Fury 161, LOOP
07: Credits, non loop
08: Final Crisis, LOOP
09: Game Over, non-loop
0A: The Mother Alien, LOOP
0B: Collect, Deliver, and Seal, LOOP
0C: Get Ready, non loop

NOTE: I missed a song to remasterize ("station repairs"), i'm on it right now.


The rest of rows are in fact the rest of HEX memory positions until 256... that confused me a bit, cause in the beginning i thought that the rows was read vertically, but i printed the thread to read it in the train, and i saw all the thing.


Last edited by Señor Ventura on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 22:20; edited 2 times in total

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ALIEN 3

Post by pepillopev on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 21:55

Señor Ventura $0B is coded out by Conn (to avoid sd2snes buzz). This is why I did not highlight it in the image I provided Conn earlier. No need to worry about it.

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Señor Ventura on Mon 12 Nov 2018 - 22:24

pepillopev wrote:Señor Ventura $0B is coded out by Conn (to avoid sd2snes buzz). This is why I did not highlight it in the image I provided Conn earlier. No need to worry about it.

Ok, is fixed now.

I'm uploading the track already with the missed song (station repairs), and a null empty track as al3_msu-5, as the tracklist says.


edit: track 5 is in $05, right?... $0B is the track 11.

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Tue 13 Nov 2018 - 5:34

edit: track 5 is in $05, right?... $0B is the track 11.
Correct. The loop table and ingame values are in hex, while the pcm numbers are in dec

I'd update the patch, but your infos are a bit contradicting:

Track 7: Pev: 03, SV: 01
Track A: Pev: 01, SV: 03

What is correct here?

And also track b is confusing... track 5 is definitely silent, but SV writes (0B: Collect, Deliver, and Seal, LOOP)...
If track b (pcm-11) is silent as well, jus don't give it into the pcm set. I included an error check, so it won't be played if not present (alike track 5). This avoids a sd2snes buzz)

Could you give me correct unambiguous info here (track 7, a, b)? I'll then update a new patch. Glad that we finish this up Wink

00: Intro, non loop
01: Title, non loop
02: Rescue Mission, LOOP
03: Station Repairs, LOOP
04: Destroy the Eggs, LOOP
05: menu, silent, non loop
06: Corridors of Fury 161, LOOP
07: Credits, non loop
08: Final Crisis, LOOP
09: Game Over, non-loop
0A: The Mother Alien, LOOP
0B: Collect, Deliver, and Seal, LOOP

0C: Get Ready, non loop
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Tue 13 Nov 2018 - 7:35

There's a further problem, check this:

Make a breakpoint at 1f8004 (X) in Original unpatched rom before starting stage 1:
$1F/8004 5C 7E 80 1F JMP $1F807E[$1F:807E]   A:0002
Then change the value in A: from 0002 to 0005
You will hear a 05 theme not used elsewhere!

I'll recode my patch so menu stays silent while this theme is played elsewhere. But I do not know if this is a "ghost track", means in the beta it was used for the menu and then dropped by the devs to silence...

Other than that, I found out the question I had above using this technique:
07: Credits, LOOP (Pev was right)
0A: The Mother Alien, LOOP (SV was right)
0B: it is a used Loop track

But also 0C actually loops with above technique in a stage. There is a fade command, but I leave it as 01 (non-loop) so the fading can be mimicked without me having to code anything more).

New table:
;     00  01   02  03   04   05   06  07   08  09   0A  0B   0C  0D  0E   0F
db $01,$01,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$01,$03,$03,$01,$03,$03,$03 ; themes 00-0f - 00
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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by pepillopev on Tue 13 Nov 2018 - 7:50

@Conn The game only has 12 tracks in its OST. It may just be we wrongly assigned it to what was previously set in the original patch as you described. This sucks, but hopefully we don’t have to play the game all the way (it is a very long game). Time to recheck nevertheless.

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Re: ALIEN 3

Post by Conn on Tue 13 Nov 2018 - 8:13

mmh, can you try with above check
- load the original rom
- make breakpoint 1F/8004 X hook AFTER the stage intro (when it starts 0002, stage theme)
- give 0005 in A

Here's the image:


Now you hear the spc theme 05 during the first stage. Maybe you can figure out what it is.

There is NO need to playtest the complete game, because here's the new patch Wink
- new correct loop table inserted
New table:
db $01,$01,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$03,$01,$03,$03,$01,$03,$03,$03 ; themes 00-0f - 00
- it does not play theme 5 in the menu, but it would play it if it is called elsewhere
Means: if you can figure out what theme 5 is, you can simply add it as pcm. That's it. If it is called elsewhere but the menu, it will play it.


Here's the new patch (permalink):
http://bszelda.zeldalegends.net/stuff/Con/alien3_msu1.zip
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Re: ALIEN 3

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