Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

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Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Zanak on Mon 28 Nov 2016 - 12:11

Was browsing through youtube and recently found this:



Just thought I'd share it.
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Zanak
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Erockbrox on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 1:39

^ I watched the video.

See how the video creator clearly states how hard the game is.

Also let me quote:

At 9:55
Everything in this game doesn't make any sense.

Other quotes:

The game is so tedious that its not even worth it
Fighting bosses in progressively ridiculous unfair situations.
Always backtracking to the same places again and again
The game trolls you with information
The game keeps useful items from you unless you consult the internet
The game is hard for the sake of being hard.
This game is one of the hardest games you will ever play
The hit points on the enemies were increased to a ridiculous degree
This game is unforgiving
The dungeons are like mazes on crack

Now does everyone here understand why I wrote up a 200 comment list regarding High Rule Tail?
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 1:47

Yes, we're all aware of the many reasons why PW is getting a 10-year-anniversary update.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Puzzledude on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 7:08

qwertymodo wrote:Yes, we're all aware of the many reasons why PW is getting a 10-year-anniversary update.
Yes, however I believe the DX doesn't actually change the difficulty, or did I miss something, which pretty much means it could receive similar reviews.

On the other hand, bringing the difficulty down, like in the Remodel, can also cause negative/positive responses. There are tons of people applouding me, for instance, for making the Remodel, which is now more playable. However many still hate the Remodel and actually like the original PW better.

This is why we should make hacks as we like and simply ignore what the audience is saying, as we all know people have different oppinions.

I also don't know why would this be in the Bar section, as the video itself is meant as a comedy, while the author clearly has issues in general.

PS
qwerty, while you are releasing DX on 10th aniversary;
I always had an idea of a Zelda Kaizo Worlds, minor remake of Parallel Worlds, which would bring the difficulty even more up. Maybe this too will be released at the same time.

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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 10:44

Well, several of the new mechanics alter the difficulty indirectly, such as the L0 stun, which hugely improves the Guardhouse, or being able to save right away, also improving the Guardhouse, or the removal of bomb damage that make bomb jumping less painful (while leaving in fall damage so you don't get away unscathed with failing a jump), or the door change in the Parallel Tower that eliminates the third climb. The game is still hard, and the levels have mostly remained unchanged, so I expect people will still complain about backtracking and other level design issues, but like you said, people will complain no matter what. The biggest complaint I've heard about remodel is that the removal of puzzles left the dungeons feeling "empty" or "boring" which is one of the reasons I didn't want to do a remodel (though you're free to use my patch to update remodel as well). I don't intend to please everyone, but I can say that so far I've played through 4 Icy World dungeons plus all of the Tower climbs with the green armor and 0 deaths except the one time when I was trying to play and babysit at the same time, so I feel like I've succeeded in adjusting the difficulty...
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Conn on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 10:44

Sorry..., but I cannot hear that anymore Sob  Parallel Worlds is hard, yes, extremely hard, and thousand of people already complained for 10 years now.
I think Euclid and SePH are in the meanwhile much aware of that... and learned. Conker is moderate easy, and you can even choose your level now.

Qwerty's patch makes the game indeed a bit easier (you can e.g., dig for heart refill), and his patch should be also compatible with Puzz' remodel, since qwerty's patch changes only the code not the indoor stuff altered by Puzz. If I am wrong, I'd suggest to create also a PR compatible version (which should be very easy).

Edit: oh, qwerty and I replied at the same time Very Happy
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 11:05

Ah yeah, digging for hearts was another one. For the most part, I intentionally tried not to reduce the difficulty, but to give you more tools to rise to the challenge. For instance, reducing the number of guards in the Guardhouse (or just switching a bunch of them for the kind that don't chase you) would have made it *easier*, Conn's stun patch lets them all stay but gives you a new way of dealing with them. Things like removing bomb damage didn't really fit that same pattern, but I felt it was worth it. The bomb jumps were one of the few things I did feel ended up in the realm of "kaizo" difficulty, because even getting every jump perfect still expended most of your health. Now, the vets who know how to do it perfectly can get through unscathed, and those less familiar with the exact positioning will have much more of a chance to get it right. Again, I know I won't please everyone, but I really have put a lot of effort into addressing a lot of the existing issues.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 11:09

Random note, I do think I'll leave the infinite digging tile, because I can't for the life of me figure out the bug, and also it's kinda funny. I may edit the overworld to remove most of them and just leave one or two, like in the secret meadow, we'll see.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Puzzledude on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 12:58

Well, several of the new mechanics alter the difficulty indirectly, such as the L0 stun, which hugely improves the Guardhouse, or being able to save right away, also improving the Guardhouse, or the removal of bomb damage that make bomb jumping less painful (while leaving in fall damage so you don't get away unscathed with failing a jump), or the door change in the Parallel Tower that eliminates the third climb.
Oh, that's great, specially the stun/boxing patch.
I now see the DX version will indeed change things.

Also, it is interesting how popular PW is, and how many reworks did/will it get.

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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Conn on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 14:11

I think I remember Euclid told about a puzzle which you cannot accomplish early as 3 hearts are too few to bomb-jump. I hope this isn't spoiled so that the non-hurt bomb-jump leads to a quasi-cheat at a certain place.

I could be wrong with my memories though.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 14:25

I'll definitely send my code to Puzzledude once it's done if he wants to apply it to Remodel as well.  It should be 95% compatible with PR, and the room edits which aren't compatible can just be commented out (unlike Conn, I actually use an assembler Wink )

As far as the bomb jump puzzle goes, I believe that was referring to the Cane of Byrna in the Halls of Pain. Yes, removing bomb damage allows you to get it earlier than before, however, I believe it was previously obtainable as early as Din's Catacombs (you just needed to collect the Goron's Bracelet to be able to get enough hearts), so it's really not by much, and then only if you don't fall. Personally, I don't like the idea of a forced-damage puzzle that requires a minimum amount of health to complete. I think you should take damage if you mess up, but if you do it perfectly, you shouldn't.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Erockbrox on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 16:54

I might even suggest that you also remove damage from falling into pits. Just make it as easy as possible.

If dungeons ever feel empty I can always design something if objects are still editable.

Or maybe start the player off with more hearts. Or remove the cracks in the walls which don't do anything and are fake outs.

But I've said too much I don't think I write to give a full write up on this game too.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by qwertymodo on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 19:41

Not gonna happen. I already added game loading with full health, I'm not going to start you off with more hearts, or remove fall damage. And I've already stated clearly that I don't intend to redesign dungeons. You should know that only cracks in the direct center of each quarter-room can even possibly be valid, which eliminates something like 70% of the fake ones right off the bat, and the fake ones in the correct positions are fairly infrequent and far between. Besides, once you pick up all of the upgrades, you never come anywhere close to running out of bombs.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by Zanak on Tue 29 Nov 2016 - 20:57

Just posting the video because it got a lot of views, which kind of disappoints me that a lot of people hearing about the hack for the first time are leaving that video with a negative impression.
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Re: Just found this video on Parallel Worlds

Post by SunGodPortal on Wed 30 Nov 2016 - 0:18

At the end of the day, most will be disappointed whether there is a video or not. If I were to be brutally honest, PW is designed to be as annoying as possible... and it IS.

Thankfully we have C'sHT now.
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