Erock's Dungeon Designs 2014-2017

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Post by Erockbrox on Fri 18 Apr 2014 - 13:08

In this one you hootshot over the warp tiles to get to the other side.

If you hookshot over them the warp is NOT activated. Somarian cane breaks this although extra blocks would prevent this. Also does anyone know if sprites can be placed in special locations that Hyrule Magic won't allow. My pegswitch here can't be aligned with the peg. Blocks can be placed anywhere, but sprites can't they have certain places only where they can be placed. Anyone know if this can't be done in like hex or something?

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I'll let you guys figure out this one on your own.

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First designs I've made with warps in them.

And I forgot to ask.... Can you even warp to the same room that the original warp was in?
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Post by Puzzledude on Fri 18 Apr 2014 - 13:45

The Peg Switch can not be aligned with the brown peg. The sprites don't have as much positions as objects. That's why you need to position sprites first, and align object to them (you need to align the brown peg to the peg switch).

Regarding warps: you can not warp to the same room, where the initial warp is in (actually you can, but you would be trapped in an endless loop). The "warping" is only possible between HM rooms, while the X and Y remain the same. If you warp to initial room, you just land on the same warp again, endlessly warping (lol, I actually tested this in the Casino dungeon, since I wanted to warp once to reset the pushable block; but instead Link warped endlessly, and could not get of the warp).

This basically means, that you can not warp to another X and Y within the same room. But: Math on Napkins actually wants to implement this in Black Magic with extensive asm.

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Post by Erockbrox on Fri 18 Apr 2014 - 23:51

puzzledude wrote:The Peg Switch can not be aligned with the brown peg. The sprites don't have as much positions as objects.

Is there anyway to overcome with limitation using ASM hacking?

puzzledude wrote:Regarding warps: you can not warp to the same room, where the initial warp is in (actually you can, but you would be trapped in an endless loop). The "warping" is only possible between HM rooms, while the X and Y remain the same. If you warp to initial room, you just land on the same warp again, endlessly warping

Thanks for the info puzzle! I have two ideas that might provide a solution for this.

1. Just make two different rooms in HM, but make them identical! ;)This way even though the player thinks they are going to the same room they actually aren't. Talk about parallel worlds...... lol

2. Remember how when using the mirror on the light world when you warp between light and dark worlds? Well after you warp there is a time period where Link is blinking or is invincible. In other words Link has a grace period between interacting with the warp on the ground that is shown in the light world and enables him to get to the dark world. Because otherwise you would have endless warping on the over-worlds too... errr well not really, but you could never then warp to the light world with the mirror because as soon as you did you would be warped right back to the dark world.

So maybe just use that same piece of code for the lightworld mirror warp and apply that to the warp on the interiors in the dungeons. That way you could warp to different locations in the same room!

Conn....... where are you Conn....... we need you!! jk Smile

Sorry for writing so much, but I hope you get what I'm saying.

[edit]

oh now i get it. even if you did do this....... it wouldn't be of any use. Because you said that Link's position stays the same. So you can't warp from one (x,y) position to a different (x,y) position.

Here is my idea. Find some way to assigning Links (x,y) position to the warp tiles position. That way Link could change his position AND be at the desired spot. The problem is linking warps together as pairs though. How would the start warp and the end warp "know" each other.
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Post by Puzzledude on Sat 19 Apr 2014 - 6:52

Exactly. The warping doesn't work this way. With the warp you simply assign on which room to go. No 2 warps would know each other in any way. You simply need one more parameter: x and y, which the current warp doesn't check for (or maybe it does?).

If the new location could be changed, then you could warp in the same room, But the current warping addresses all warps in the room! So with one asm, you would need another one (much more complicated one), to change that.

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Post by Erockbrox on Thu 1 May 2014 - 23:58

one possibility that could work for warping from one spot in a room to another spot is as follows.

have a room and have the two warp tiles in it. the start warp (yellow) and the end warp (gray).

when you hit the yellow warp you then go to another room....... but that other room is just like the original room (yet really different room number in HM)

the rooms are made identical yet they are offset from each other, meaning if a pot has an (x,y) position then in the warped room it will not have the same (x,y) position. YET, link will have the same (x,y) position as before.

basically you make two different rooms that are identical and when you warp Link's position never changes, but all the contents in the room have now changed in from their original positions making it seem as if Links position changed!

so in other words.... link doesn't move around the room ....... the room moved around link.

at least its a way of doing it without any asm.
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Post by Puzzledude on Fri 2 May 2014 - 6:24

I don't think this is doable, since then you would have scroll problems for sure. The warping rooms must not be shifted, but rather ideantical to perserve correct scrolling, specially if the room is smaller (quarter).

The only way to warp correctly, is to make 2 different rooms. Step on warp1 in room1, make your way to the warp2 in room2, landing on the desired position in room1. So globaly you made it from warp1 to end position in one room (which was your goal I believe).

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Post by Erockbrox on Sat 21 Jun 2014 - 0:33

Smile




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Post by Erockbrox on Tue 22 Jul 2014 - 22:07

The puzzle works as so.

You enter by the left door and you must move the statue to the floor switch an order to open the closed door on the right.

you push one way until you can push no more and must go around the other way to pull it out.

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no hard at all but its at least a nice one.
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Post by Erockbrox on Sun 27 Jul 2014 - 3:49

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Post by Erockbrox on Tue 5 Aug 2014 - 19:17

ice ice baby!!!

goal is to come into the room and get the chest and then leave. the two blocks shown are pushable (1 time only ) blocks.

best used if link doesnt have the mirror warping ability but if the player doesnt know how to escape then i guess they could just save and quit.

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Post by Tompala on Wed 6 Aug 2014 - 4:19

Has two solutions even.

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Post by Erockbrox on Wed 6 Aug 2014 - 21:31

Right when I read your post I was like....... two solutions??? no.

and then I quickly though of the second one.

First solution is to hook-shot to the chest and then hoot-shot past the spike and move the block cloestest to the chest first then move the other block.

This is the easy and typical solution as not everyone knows about the hookshot though the block while the actual block is moving.

So with that said. You could also hookshot right through the first block and then again hootshot though the second block as well.

but wait......

you cannot hookshot past the second block because there is nothing to grab onto.

unless you are talking about escaping then, but it doesnt work that way either.

as far as i know you must hookshot to the chest no matter what.
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Post by Erockbrox on Wed 6 Aug 2014 - 21:54

Assume the block in the middle of the square is an infinitely pushable block.

The idea is that if the player pushes just one push in the wrong direction it becomes stuck.

Push block on the floor switch to then open the door.

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Post by Tompala on Thu 7 Aug 2014 - 5:36

Hookshot the chest and then either hookshot through the block while it's moving or shoot through the spike to the block and then push the second one normally.

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Post by Puzzledude on Thu 7 Aug 2014 - 6:41

Erockbrox wrote:Right when I read your post I was like....... two solutions??? no.

and then I quickly though of the second one.

First solution is to hook-shot to the chest and then hoot-shot past the spike and move the block closest to the chest first then move the other block.

This is the easy and typical solution as not everyone knows about the hookshot though the block while the actual block is moving.
To fully implement that, there's one more thing to be done. What if the player moves the right block to the left and then hookshots the chest (he gets stuck). This is why Alttp has one more pot beside the pushable blocks in the ice palace. In this case one more pot is needed on the left side of the 2nd (right) block. The same goes for the left block. Someone could move the right block down, go into the corridor, move the second block left and then hookshot the chest (again stuck). The third option is to hookshot through the right stone while it is moving left (third stuck situation). So the 2 pots will "debug" all that.

Regarding the 2 solutions, it is actually more like 1 solution with 2 versions.

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Post by Erockbrox on Thu 7 Aug 2014 - 21:37

Here is my ice ice baby fix.

I'm glad you pointed out these issues Puzzle since I never saw them before.

The idea with the pot works, but the whole purpose of this puzzle was to escape back though the pushable blocks.

Here is my best way to remedy this. Using a warp the player can reset the blocks by warping to another room and then back again.

The only thing that this doesn't fix is the case where you hookshot though the most left block and you have already pushed the right block forward and to the left.

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Post by Puzzledude on Fri 8 Aug 2014 - 6:10

I just give it a second thought. The solution with the warp is the only way (good thinking). The pots wouldn't solve it, since you could still lift the pot from the left, push the left block to the right and get stuck again.

The only other way would be to put a non pushable block next to the left pushable block (but of course the warp works too, you just need to use one more room).

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Post by Erockbrox on Sat 16 Aug 2014 - 20:35

Infinite pushable block puzzle

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Post by Erockbrox on Sun 17 Aug 2014 - 5:14

Another infinite block puzzle. This is a BIG one.

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Post by Erockbrox on Wed 3 Sep 2014 - 23:49

Infinite pushable block puzzles

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Post by Puzzledude on Thu 4 Sep 2014 - 6:37

Nice ideas, Erock, I hope you tested this in practice.

Having the cave wall-blockset with the multipushable block is problematic, the same goes for any type of floor, which is not made out of squares (since the block is reloading the floor).

The next thing is the wall frame. The block will erase this frame if it touches it. Because of that, the pushable area is usually defined without the frame, making it slightly different. The blocks then come on actual even x and y (in your case they are on odd x and y, but the frame makes it into even).

Similar with the doors. Havent tested in your version, but the block usually starts destroying the door if you push it into it, thus the door needs to be "walled-in". Will give you more info, when I test your versions.

Edit

tested this out:
it works (door is not affected), the only effect is in the frame.

Erock's Dungeon Designs 2014-2017 - Page 4 Test000

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Post by Puzzledude on Thu 4 Sep 2014 - 9:15

Here my strategy of building the area with multipushable blocks.


Erock's Dungeon Designs 2014-2017 - Page 4 Test2

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Post by Erockbrox on Thu 4 Sep 2014 - 22:46

Thanks Puzzle!

I actually had not tested these out yet. I only made them in hyrule magic and took a screenshot.

Since I know how blocks move I figured that I didn't even need to test it. lol

Good thing there are people like you who know more about the game engine and can point out stuff like this.

Hopefully all that needs to be done in those rooms is to add the small barrier around the room as a frame.

Even if that doesn't work they could always be placed in a bigger room to make the even tile the pushable block and then the room can be scaled down to be much smaller than normal an order to fix the odd even thing.
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Post by Erockbrox on Thu 18 Sep 2014 - 1:42

here is a puzzle based off of the block creating block. that is a block that when pushed it created another solid block.

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Post by Puzzledude on Thu 18 Sep 2014 - 7:55

Erockbrox wrote:here is a puzzle based off of the block creating block. that is a block that when pushed it created another solid block.

Erock's Dungeon Designs 2014-2017 - Page 4 Blockcreator_zpsc8820949
Yes, that's exactly how I made it in the IQ hack. Unfortunately this "stone" block is very limited, due to its movement. I could build much better puzzles with the water block, with Conn's Asm of not be able to push the block if standing in the water. You'll see what I mean, when the game is released.

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