not sure if you know, but the game will not allow a pipe and hurting pits at the same time, namely if you use the pipe and fall down and get respawned back to the entrance you have entered, you can not use the same pipe anymore

I noticed that strange behaviour during my testruns but I didn't know how to fix this. Eventually I forgot about this a bit later in development. It would be great if you guys know a way how to fix this.

I believe this is fixable only with small ASM. Basically the game will not reset the pipe, but if you go through the door, it will. So basically something gets written somewhere after you use the pipe, this should be put to Nop, as if you would walk through the door. I hope Conn is not completely retired to still fix this, since Nintendo made some odd choices: pipes+hurting pits are not possible and also warps and hurting pits are not possible. If you fall down the hole and get respawned and are blinking and step on the warp while blinking, then sprites of the entire dungeon might disappear. If both these things with hurting pits are fixed - Alttp modding will get a releave of further repetitive bugs.

It had many bugs while creating it, for example Link occesinally jumping up stairs instead of going upstairs/downstairs normaly

Yes, this is a common bug, which should be fixed if the correct type of the staircase is used (must not be regular but something else, so that this bug does not occur - basically the game thinks Link is moving in and out of water and makes a jumping mechanism.

What do you mean the path to the arrow target is optional? You need to remove the wall in order to get access to the gauntlet in order to get one of the last keys to reach the boss.
Edit: Found it. You could hookshot over some spikes and get that key. Fixed it.

Yes, basically it is possible to not open the wall and still get the key - that's how I got it, but then I went to the arrow target, opened the wall and followed the path and came to the same key. Glad you fixed it.

There are many paths to choose, I also thought to should add some shortcuts to make it less tedious at times, but I don't know where to put them. This dungeon is packed really tight together, using warps an such in all central rooms.

Yes, this dungeon is similar strategy of multi paths and staicases as original. One possibility would be that room with 4 small holes, that leads to 4 different paths for the key or chests. Basically make it possible to reach more of these paths by falling into just one hole and removing some big fences, but of course this is your choice and is not mandatory to do.

With the boss, I always wanted to create a boss room where you fall through before you get to it, designwise. I know that the palette might get bugged if you fall down during the battle, but fixing itself afterwards (after going upstairs).

I didn't know this fixes it.

But I didn't encountered other gamebreaking bugs so I thought it would be fine as it is. Also there is a bug with the miniboss, Trinexx. I don't know why the game puts his shell in the upperleft room after defeating him.

Yes, the game will always move the shell, since this is how it is programmed. It doesn't get rid of the shell, the shell is transported into left up area (since the original game thought this area is unused), and it must go somewhere. Not sure if this can be fixed or changed.

Also the same room 88 should be put all transition-plane settings to 0, instead of 2 - otherwise one staircase will bring you falsly to plane 2 (when in fast is on bg1)

Room 88? Room 88 is part of Level 7.

Yes, I made a mistake here. It was room 59 leading to 26. And the staircase in the right down corner. So basically I used HM to and put the plane on room 59 to 0 and all transits worked fine. Before that lower right staircase was sending me from room 59 bg1 to room 26 bg2.

Did you encounter that one graphic bug I mentioned in the readme? Where pots and such all looks messed up. I don't know how this happens and how to fix it.

I've seen this bug before but not in such extent. In the final dungeon every fall down the pit, or use of any medallion will make this bug - false gfx loading. This should be fixable only with ASM - not sure what is causing this, since you didn't edit gfx.

Also do you have a list of dungeons you liked the most and dungeons who aren't as good as the others? (Like 1. Level 5 2. Level 2 ...)

Here is my subjective oppinion:
all dungeon edits: 9/10

intro dungeon: 4/5
1st pendant: 5/5
2nd pendant: 3/5
3rd pendant: 4/5
final light-world dungeon: 4/5
light-world semi dungeon: 5/5

level-1 dark world: 4/5
level-2 dark world: 5/5
level-3 dark world: 4/5
level-4 dark world: 5/5
level-5 dark world: 5/5
level-6 dark world: 4/5
level-7 dark world: 4/5
level-8 dark world: 4/5
level-9 dark world: 3/5

I don't know how I could oversee this big mistake, fixed it know (so you never went the intended way to get the red mail? I also wanted to make that mail optional, but usefull for the final floors. But if you skip it you can also skip one hard last challenge to get the last key on the final floor befor Agahanim).

First I went back and got the red mail in a non-intended way. But then I found the correct/intended way and also reached the same big chest the way it was planed. Glad you fixed it.

Thanks again for your feedback^^
I'am a bit surprised that pendand dungeon 1 flows that good, I thought it would be the least best light world dungeon.

Anyway, I updated the first post with V0.95, fixing some of the bugs Puzzledude mentioned (see changelog for more).

I believe this is fixable only with small ASM. Basically the game will not reset the pipe, but if you go through the door, it will. So basically something gets written somewhere after you use the pipe, this should be put to Nop, as if you would walk through the door. I hope Conn is not completely retired

I can take a glimpse... but I need a detailed description of the problem (images?) and a snes9x 1.51 savestate for geiger tracing.

Edit: and of course the patch (or better: rom) sent to con.s@gmx.de

Conn wrote:

I believe this is fixable only with small ASM. Basically the game will not reset the pipe, but if you go through the door, it will. So basically something gets written somewhere after you use the pipe, this should be put to Nop, as if you would walk through the door. I hope Conn is not completely retired

I can take a glimpse... but I need a detailed description of the problem (images?) and a snes9x 1.51 savestate for geiger tracing.

Edit: and of course the patch (or better: rom) sent to con.s@gmx.de

Ok I'm sending you the files.

It is just now when modding this game we see how many things are in fact wrong with the original game (but we never noticed from the original since it doesn't have such situations).


The bug is really easy to reproduce. Basically when you load save state use the left pipe. When you come out fall down into the pit - you will be respawned just before the pipe again. Now use the pipe and it will not work. If you go down the stairs and come back up, the pipe can be used again, since it reset.

Basically original authors always made sure that the pipe and pits that hurt the player are never in one room together. So if you use the pipe form A to B, only B is valid to enter. If you go from B to A again, the A will work.

But if you use A to B (then B is valid) and fall down, you are respawned back to A (while only B is valid). Not sure why they programed this in such a way, since all pipes should always be valid to enter.

Original game will not even allow this scenario:
you gave 2 pipes and thus 4 pipe entrances: A-B and C-D.

If you go from A to B (B becomes valid, A becomes invalid) and then can reach C,
and go from C to D and by that are still able to reach A with walking on the floor, the A pipe entrance will not work. Since the travel before from A to B made A invalid.

So you basically don't need to fall down the pit at all, since the initial travel from A to B, made A invalid in any case and only B valid in the A-B pair. This is all together an odd decision by the creators, since it limits the traveling severely.

ok, received it and already traced the responsible ram value, it is 7e0D05, and also other values in this region I did not trace.

Unfortunately, this problem is not trivial, there is a complex algorithm behind this. I played around a bit and the pipes transported me into other rooms, even.

There might be a complex asm solution (checking for room, save the value to an intermediate ram, check whether you fell into a pit, call then the intermediate value, save it again to the correct place in the 7e0d00 region...)
But this is so bug affective and complex that I suggest not go for it.

Can you think about a clever HM solution? e.g., if you fall into water, you will be transported to the edge where you fell in... so using different tiles with water properties here?
If something like this won't work, I'd say, the cane somaria puzzle here is so little that you easily can renounce on it and restrict the floors that you cannot fall down.

So so schon wieder ein Deutscher Habs mir fast gedacht bei deinem Nickname Willkommen

So ich suche noch nen guten Dungeon Editor

Conn wrote:ok, received it and already traced the responsible ram value, it is 7e0D05, and also other values in this region I did not trace.

Unfortunately, this problem is not trivial, there is a complex algorithm behind this. I played around a bit and the pipes transported me into other rooms, even.

There might be a complex asm solution (checking for room, save the value to an intermediate ram, check whether you fell into a pit, call then the intermediate value, save it again to the correct place in the 7e0d00 region...)
But this is so bug affective and complex that I suggest not go for it.

Can you think about a clever HM solution? e.g., if you fall into water, you will be transported to the edge where you fell in... so using different tiles with water properties here?
If something like this won't work, I'd say, the cane somaria puzzle here is so little that you easily can renounce on it and restrict the floors that you cannot fall down.

Yes too bad. I thought this to be an easy solution. So if it is to complex and further bug affected, we can think of the HM solution to not allow such scenarios (either replace pipe with somaria path on some occasions, or preserve the pipe and block of the pits in other screnarios).

Spane wrote:So so schon wieder ein Deutscher Habs mir fast gedacht bei deinem Nickname Willkommen

So ich suche noch nen guten Dungeon Editor

Yes Spane, maybe you can convince Intim, that making a full complete hack on his own is not a smart decision and convince him to team up on the Prophet of Chaos project. Plus: you, he and Xaser are from the same country as far as I know (which is even more interesting).

Yes, sorry that I cannot be of help with those pipes.

*lol, if it continues that the German language hijacks the forums, we should speak about a German development subforum ^^

Just joking, we are capable of speaking English and except some funny exceptions, we should hold it in English. I remember one mental-ill guy who spammed the forums with Spanish offenses.

Conn wrote:Unfortunately, this problem is not trivial, there is a complex algorithm behind this. I played around a bit and the pipes transported me into other rooms, even.

There might be a complex asm solution (checking for room, save the value to an intermediate ram, check whether you fell into a pit, call then the intermediate value, save it again to the correct place in the 7e0d00 region...)
But this is so bug affective and complex that I suggest not go for it.

That's sad, but thanks anyway for looking into it
There are three rooms in Level 4 (two on F1 and one on B1) where this bug might be really bad, forcing the player to use the mirror, which isn't the best solution at all. But I don't want to remodel the Level too much.

Spane wrote:So so schon wieder ein Deutscher Very Happy Habs mir fast gedacht bei deinem Nickname Very Happy Willkommen Very Happy

So ich suche noch nen guten Dungeon Editor Razz

Haha, danke^^
Wenn ich behilflich sein könnte schreib mich dann einfach an
Ich habe aber noch ein kleines Projekt im Kopf, welches zwar nicht so groß, aber neue Graphiken und ein paar kleine ASM Patches enthalten soll (Eigentlich ein großes Dungeon/Burg, die in verschiedene Sektionen eingeteilt ist, die man teilweise in verschiedenen Reihenfolgen machen kann).

Conn wrote:Just joking, we are capable of speaking English and except some funny exceptions, we should hold it in English. I remember one mental-ill guy who spammed the forums with Spanish offenses.

Sadly, there are always these kind of people around.

Arnachy, I somehow do not get an idea what you're trying to tell us. If you have critique on the forum's policies, please try to tell us in proper English. We are always open for suggestions, as long they're not offensive.

So Puzzle you mean:
Myself: Overworld
Intim: Dungeons
Xaser: ASM

I hope this is possible

Spane wrote:So Puzzle you mean:
Myself: Overworld
Intim: Dungeons
Xaser: ASM

I hope this is possible

Yes, or you also do: Overworlds and some (but not all) dungeons, since I know your light world dungeons are very well designed already.

I finish the introduction and 1st pendant dungeons.. Guy, It's amazing man!
I love play it... WOOOOOOW <3

Good to hear that you like my hack so far^^


Is there some special byte that need to be changed so that the correct dungeon music will be played if you fall down during the Moldrum battle? Because the boss music still plays if you fall down during the boss fight in the first pendant dungeon and this kind of bugs me.

Also I belief the boss markers on the map in the dark world dungeons only show up if you completed the Agahnim Level before. But my Hyrule Castle uses the Castle map in Hyrule Magic. Is there a way to change this or do I need a different solution?

And one last thing, my messages always get bugged if I edit them. I know that I have to be carefull not to reach the character limit per line, but they still get messed up. Do I need to use the exact same amount of text as before or did I missed something?

Is there some special byte that need to be changed so that the correct dungeon music will be played if you fall down during the Moldrum battle? Because the boss music still plays if you fall down during the boss fight in the first pendant dungeon and this kind of bugs me.

This unfortunatelly falls under ASM, to control which music to play on such occasions. Similar to Ganon fight - the special code then tells the game to switch back to Pyramid music after the fall - by default the same music is played in the entire dungeon (and again special code to tell it to switch to boss music when you reach the boss). The default code however was also expeting the switch from boss back to regular dungeon music by default (if the floor is changed!) - but this might not be valid for certain dungeons or gets bugged, or is invalid with normal room transit - and the boss music is played in the dungeon.

Also I belief the boss markers on the map in the dark world dungeons only show up if you completed the Agahnim Level before. But my Hyrule Castle uses the Castle map in Hyrule Magic. Is there a way to change this or do I need a different solution?

Again ASM, since you need to trace with Geiger's SNES debugger to see which byte needs changing for this. Probably is one byte which  corresponds to Agahnim-1 and should then be changed to byte coresponding to Castle.

And one last thing, my messages always get bugged if I edit them. I know that I have to be carefull not to reach the character limit per line, but they still get messed up. Do I need to use the exact same amount of text as before or did I missed something?

You must not exceed the space in ROM for monologue - which means they can not be longer than what original can handle. But in this rom something bugged the monologues beyond a certain number - HM does this a lot - so they look as if they are shifted by one. Sometimes HM will destroy monologues above 256 completely. I use backups in such cases (or debug the rom using hex to bring in the original code of Alttp monologues).

1. I suggest you use Geiger on the original rom's moldrum and fall down the pit. Make a trace log when the dungeon theme is written to $012c. Then make a second log of your rom (fall down the pit at Moldrum) to see why it doesn't switch (compare both logs why the cpu branches over the music switch). I do not know how the music switch is triggered (could be room, falling routine, etc).

It should be the switch from 7e012c-15 (boss) to 7e012c-11 (lw dungeon).

2. Do you mean the boss skull when in a dungeon and having the compass?

Yes I mean the boss skulls that appear when your having the compass inside a dungeon.

And thanks for you're answers, I will try this out later

Hi IntimFuchtler (can stop laughing cause of this name ),

i am glad to see, that someone uses my TotT-Menu Patch. I always found this menu (originally designed by Euclid) very beautiful.

I read your readme how to patch and found a mistake. You wrote that one have to patch against the unheadered Zelda(U) ROM without header, size 1.049.088 bytes. But the only ROM with that size is the german one. All others (U, Europe, USA) have a size of 1.048.576 bytes. Since patching against the german one was leading to serious bugs i assume you meant "Untouched Zelda 3 (U) ROM without header and a size of 1.048.576 bytes".

PS: Willkommen im Prophet of Chaos Projekt

Thanks for the info, I overlooked this, will fix it later^^
And I also found your/Euclids menu very nice

Hi! I'm trying to play this hack but I can't enter Palace of Darkness. Every time I go to the maze where Kiki should be he's not there, instead there is a glitched Muldorm stuck in the top right corner of the maze. What can I do?
I've tried windows versions of ZSNES 1.51, ZSNES 1.51 FuSoYa and Snes9X v1.53 (same save file). Same problem with all.
Everything up the that point is fine and it's a really nice rom hack so far.

Could you show me a screenshot please? I don't know what happened cuz' for me it's working fine. I could upload a safestate where kiki already opened the gate if you want but I also want to know why this is bugged in your version

NoMercy wrote:Hi! I'm trying to play this hack but I can't enter Palace of Darkness. Every time I go to the maze where Kiki should be he's not there, instead there is a glitched Muldorm stuck in the top right corner of the maze. What can I do?
I've tried windows versions of ZSNES 1.51, ZSNES 1.51 FuSoYa and Snes9X v1.53 (same save file). Same problem with all.
Everything up the that point is fine and it's a really nice rom hack so far.

Could you show me a screenshot please? I don't know what happened cuz' for me it's working fine. I could upload a safestate where kiki already opened the gate if you want but I also want to know why this is bugged in your version.

I had the same problem. It seems that this entire dark world area has false sprites. I believe it was a false part definition. So it is loading false sprites in this area. I fixed this with HM when I was playing, so I could continue. This area definitely got sprite bugged for some reason (common thing actually). Since when you open it up in HM, you can see this area has a Mouldrum sprite and similar sprites where Kiki used to be and I had monologues displayed wrong. But, Intim, if this is working for you (in your rom) then something went wrong with either patch making or patching.

The emulator version or type doesn't matter of course.

These are the desired sprites (however sprites part-1 are not loading in dark world, but in light world)




This is what it's actually loading




In dark world 1st and 2nd part (global stage of the game) should have the same sprites, as it is in Alttp. Not sure what is going wrong here.